tv At This Hour With Berman and Michaela CNN October 2, 2014 8:00am-9:01am PDT
found out. >> it has been confirmed that five students may have come in contact with an individual recently diagnosed with the ebola virus. >> the parents' response, plus we try to answer the question, are doctors ready for an upswing in people worried about ebola. >> minutes away from a dangerous deadline, tensions rising in hong kong, protesters surround government buildings, police say there will be serious consequences if they do not disburse now. we have a live report ahead. good morning i'm john berman. >> i'm michaela pereira. we'll start with the latest on the ebola virus, new steps to contain it now it's been diagnosed here for the first time ever. there's no telling how far it has already spread. we're learning that health officials are reaching out to up to 100 people in the dallas area
who may have been exposed or have come in contact with a patient that has the deadly virus. they're monitoring those who came into contact with the ebola-stricken patient and are tracing his contacts' contacts. the patient, thomas eric duncan remains in serious but stable condition in isolation at texas health presbyterian hospital in dallas, the same hospital that turned him away last week saying his symptoms did not warrant admission. >> duncan was contagious at that time. family members with whom he was staying are now being ordered to stay home and not have any visitors. dr. anthony fauci director of the national institutes of health explains the importance of this step for both the family members and also the first responders. >> the people who were in the emergency response as well as the family who had very close contact, perhaps even with bodily fluids, they are
relatively speaking, at a higher risk than some of the other people who came into contact. although all of the contacts will be monitored, when you quarantine somebody, you feel that the risk is high enough, you want to make sure that you don't miss the development of symptoms and have them have contact with somebody else. >> there's so much news on the ebola story. we're covering all the angles this morning. our chief medical correspondent dr. sanjay gupta is outside the cdc. senior medical correspondent elizabeth cohen joins us from presbyterian hospital in dallas. elizabeth, it is from dallas where we've been getting mixed and sometimes confusing information this morning about how many people are being contacted about possibly being exposed to this patient, how many people are being monitored and what the difference is. >> all right, john, as you said, we got a rush of this information early this morning and a rush to correct it. this is what we know to be true at this moment, we are told that
about 100 people are going to get phone calls and they're going to say, hey, what kind of contact did you have with trom mass eric duncan. this is casting a wide net, 100 people who are possible contacts of mr. duncan. as far as we know right now, authorities say only about 12 people are actual contacts of his. only 12 people are known to have contact with him. but we know that that number, that 12 number, will be going up. john? >> i'm going to pick up with sanjay now because i know one of the things that you and elizabeth and many of the medical professionals that have talked to us on the air about this is awareness, the information, the key is for people to be informed. let's get down to brass tacks and inform our viewers on how this virus is spread. there are so many questions remaining here. >> reporter: it's one of these things where i think there has been some confusion around
exactly what constitutes someone as being high risk. let me tell you a couple of things. first of all, we talk about the fact that you have to have had direct contact with the person's bodily fluids in order to actually potentially be considered a contact or potentially be exposed. i want to put a graphic up if i can, quickly. i don't want this to look too confusing, but take a quick look. what is considered high risk, what is considered low risk and what is considered somebody that they're keeping an eye on. high risk person, somebody that has symptoms and obviously had contact with someone who had ebola, known exposure, they'll get tested. someone who is a low risk, somebody who lives in the same household, they don't necessarily get tested. that's someone to keep an eye on. if they develop symptoms frngs then that may warrant testing. the third category, these are people who may be traveling through west africa, may be there as tourists, no exposure to anybody with ebola, have not
been in the hospital. they probably won't get tested. if they develop symptoms, they might get tested only because fi they got exposed to someone with ebola and didn't know it. that's the third category. it's not cut and dry. it's not fever, travel west africa. you automatically have ebola, you automatically need to get tested. it's a little bit more nuanced than that. that graphic puts it in perspective. >> elizabeth, i want to go back to you on the ground in dallas. part of that group that was not on the graphic are these people who have essentially been guaranteed. it's the emts, first responders and family members of duncan who had contact with him. tell us about these groups? >> so these four family members, this is the group that i know about, these four family members were told several days ago, hey, please don't leave your home. we're told by the texas department of health that these family members had challenges, that was their word, challenges in following these instructions. now they've sort of put down the heavy arm of the law and said, we're legally requiring you to
stay at home. now, we don't know why. and this is a huge question mark in my head. we're told that these family members aren't sick. by definition, even if they're infected with ebola, they can't spread ebola. i've been talking to my sources and no one can figure out why they want them to stay home. maybe they're worried that they're going to leave and never come back and then you're really in a pickle. i really don't know what the answer is. these four family members are told not to leave the house and the state is working out plans to bring them food and whatnot so they can stay put in their house. >> isn't that one of the challenges, elizabeth. maybe sanjay, you can jump in on this, is the fact that if you aren't showing symptoms, you're not going to test positive for ebola. the incubation period, as you were talking to us earlier this morning, between two and 21 days. sometimes we're not real honest about how we feel and we might just brush it off as flu. we are getting into flu season which is a concern because some people might mistakenly say, oh,
i'm probably just a little bit under the weather. therein lie as bit of concern for medical professionals, sanjay. >> it's interesting. because elizabeth brings up a really important point which we have talked about, this idea you're going to garn teen people, but why. who are you protecting, are you protecting the general public? they're not sick so can't spread the virus. i asked that same question to dr. fauci earlier today. what he said is, look, if there are people that you're worried about, maybe out in public, starting to get sick as you pointed out michaela. because they're starting to get sick, they could start to become someone who could become infectious. they're not being closely monitored enough and they could become someone who could become a source of infection. the best sense, if you're truly worried, is to just guy ahead and put them under quarantine. don't let them out in the general public. they can get monitored in their own homes. >> that makes sense.
you don't want them to start to get sick. >> look at what we saw with this patient that arrived from liberia. he was fine. he had his temperature taken before he left. when he arrived here. it was only days later that he got sick. that causes some discrepancies in how we can understand how it progresses and how it transmits. our thanks to both of you for joining us. in fact, we want sanjay to stick around if you can. we have more questions. >> that's right. you can always send us your question, the hash tag is ebolaqanda. i head at this hour we're going to ask many of these questions that you're asking, one, how was ebola spread. experts say it is not airborne. really do they know that and what exactly does that mean? >> something else in the air, this time aiding in the search for missing college student hannah graham. they are now using drones. what exactly are they looking
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or i'm just not really getting any better. don't wait to seek out medical help. >> she would know. that was ebola survivor nancy writebol, the missionary we know offering her advice that the virus has been diagnosed for the first time in the u.s. health officials in dallas are monitoring people, about a dozen including five children who came in contact with this man, thomas eric duncan during the four days he was contagious but not in isolation. also contacting as many as 100 other people. >> the monitoring will last about 21 days. that is the longest that doctors would think it would take for ebola symptoms to emerge. as they wait, four of duncan's relatives have been told to stay home and not receive visitors. joining us to talk about all this, dr. jorge rodriguez, an enterist who has led all kinds of clinical trials. doctor, you say the next few weeks will teach us a lot about
how ebola spreads. isn't that a little worrisome in itself, to say we will learn about ebola suggests that there's plenty we don't know right now. >> let's start off by saying there's plenty we do know. there is cautious vigilance is what we need to do. what i'm saying is that most of what we know about ebola we have gathered from people that have already been infected with ebola. we know what happens once you catch it and after the fact. what i'm most concerned about is that period before people start showing classic symptoms. are people truly not contagious at that time? if we now with the help of obviously the cdc and nih, if we start seeing different patterns of infection occurring perhaps in washington, in belgium, in dallas, then perhaps there's a little bit more that we don't know. that will -- that's what we'll start learning in the next couple weeks. yes, it's a little bit worley
so worrisome. >> you have given tremendous recommendations. some were high level steps to contain this virus. we'll throw them up and people can follow along with me. instructing all hospitals and physicians on what questions to ask, where to send blood samples, where to refer patients, creating a quicker test to diagnose ebola, standardizing tests to diagnose ebola, standardizing tests for all foreign travellers, not just people coming from west africa. i want to go back to that first one, instructing all hospitals and physicians on what questions to ask. we see what went wrong in dallas, the fact that a nurse didn't recognize the fact or take the travel history of that man who is now sick with ebola. what do we need to do to make sure every hospital, every nurse's office, every clinic, urgent care, et cetera, across the nation is ready for proper screening. >> correct. listen, this may be high level decisions. i'm hoping some high level people are watching, but it
shouldn't be too difficult. there needs to be, perhaps, a hotline established. like nancy recommended, the woman who had ebola, people are going to be coming to my office, my patients when they have a fever. i need to know what number to call. i've gone on the cdc web size, virts confusing. the couple hours to get information may be crucial. information should probably be disseminated from the local health authorities, perhaps here in los angeles, the los angeles county health authority to different entities. that's one thing. we need to have quick access to inform the powers that be, the cdc we have someone that's suspicious. that's one thing. that's what i mean by that. >> a lot of people nervous right now about ebola. a lot of the focus on ebola. meanwhile there are people dieing from enterovirus, d 68, four people have died, many from the respiratory issues. now there are fears that it
might also be calling paralysis in some other people. do we need to be paying more attention to this? is that virus getting more dangerous? >> well, like dr. sanjay gupta said, that theoretically is going to be affecting hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people like it does every year. we do need to be cautious. parents that have kids that already have respiratory diseases like asthma, need to be paying special attention that they are at their prime and at their best health so if they do catch this, they don't get the highest chance of getting some complications. so, yes, that is a little bit more of a concern right now than ebola just because of the sheer numbers that it could affect. >> on the soccer fields this is what people are talking about. dr. jorge rodriguez, thank you for being with us. >> interesting to hear an internist, a man that has medical practice that sees patients all the time that says he finds the cdc site confusing. that is a concern, if you can't find substantive information
about ebola on the website. >> the other key things he mentioned, that period we're in right now, that per period betw contact and when symptoms may emerge. that's the area that's the most unknown. that's what's happening right now. ahead "at this hour," a whole bunch of bad news sinks the secret service director, but will replacing the leadership help that agency shape up? we'll speak with someone who worked for them. that's next. begins october 15th and ends decembe so call to enroll in a plan that could give you the benefits and stability you're looking for, an aarp medicarecomplete plan insured through unitedhealthcare. what makes it complete? it can combine medicare parts a and b, which is your hospital and doctor coverage with part d prescription drug coverage, and more, all in one simple plan. for a low monthly premium or in some areas,
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from the military, from the fbi, from maybe private security to really take a top-down, a thorough approach for this for the long-term fix to be in play. >> at this hour, that is one of the key questions facing the secret service. can the agency clean itself up? there's a new director now, at least a temporary one because the old one resigned after a congressional oversight committee spent a day basically grilling here overall sorts of revelations that just seem to come to light every day. >> julie pierson telling bloomberg news, quote, congress has lost confidence in my ability to run the agency. the media has made it clear that this is what they expected. i can be pretty sewic about it, but not really. it's painful to leave as the agency is reeling from a significant security breach. joseph clancy is now running the shop for now. he's serving as the interim director, a former special agent in charge of the presidential protective division. we have andrew o'connell, a former secret service agent, now
a security consultant. nice to see you again. you were with us here on "new day." good to have you here. right decision for her to step down? is this a step in the right direction? do you feel hopeful that the agency can move in a new direction now? >> i think as it relates to the director, i think she might the right decision given congress apparently has made it clear that they lost faith in her. i don't think she should have stepped down because of the recent security incidents. i think she was a great special agent, a great supervisor. when people lose confidence, i think she made the right decision. >> our jake tapper is reporting the final straw with the white house, the white house lost confidence in her, too, not in her abilities, but in her truth telling abilities, what they say is the final straw was the fact that she did not tell them about that elevator incident where there was an armed security contractor on the elevator. she did not tell that the white house despite all the questions, all the investigationtion over the last few weeks. they felt there was a problem with forthcomingness.
is that a cultural thing in the secret service? >> absolutely not. i think if you look at the history of the secret service, remember the secret service has been around for 150 years, at least 100 protecting the president. incidents happen over the years. we had the assassination of a president, attempted assassinations. we've had things that have happened. the key is to figure out what went wrong. certainly what happened at the house is awful, shouldn't have happened. there's a security plan in place that wasn't executed. people need to be held accountable form it. i don't think this relates to some broader cultural issue within the secret service. really you have to look at 100 years of pretty good service of every day protecting the president. it's not easy. things will happen. when they do, you have to recover. >> let's talk about going forward. there's no sense in dwelling in the past. make sure you fix the problems and move on i think is key. we have an interim director, a guy who has been in the secret service a long time himself. he was part of the presidential protection format.
so he clearly has insight into what needs to be done here. some are saying he might not be the right guy to stay there in a permanent role because he's an insider and has suggested as you heard it said a second ago, maybe we need to bring somebody in from the outside, somebody from the military. do you agree with that? >> with respect to the new director, he's a great selection, he's an agent's agent. they respect him tochlt the extent morale is in a different place, that helps. as it relates to the question of what to do now, it's a balancing act that the secret service does every day. the president, congress and the american people want him out there. they want him accessible. the secret service is constantly trying to pull him back. how do you find that balance? you can make that place into a fortress, you can bury it, make it so it's minimized the risk completely that something is going to happen to the president. that's unreasonable. you have to continue to take steps and learn from problems in the past. trying to find out what happened to all the officers on the grounds that day and why there was not a response or the
response was inadequate is really critical to better securing the white house. i think that making a military institution or bringing in a general, if that's what the american people want and that's what congress wants and they think the american people accept a militarization of the white house, security at the white house, that's what's going to happen. >> first of all, i don't think anyone questions the bravery or the courage of the people who serve in the secret service. no first family ever questions it either. but tell us -- you tried to explain the conflict inherent between what the president and political advisers want in any administration and what the secret service wants. >> the most difficult part i think of being an agent. you constantly have white house staff, the families making requests that many some ways could compromise security. i heard recently there was an alarm muted at the white house at the request of someone at the white house. you think something like that would make it to the highest levels of the secret service and be denied. there are certain requests that the secret service gives in to. it's a give and take.
after all, it's the president. he gets what he wants. if he wants the secret service to back off in certain ways, that will not jeopardize security, the secret service will do that. there comes a point where there are certain standards they won't fall below. i think that's the case there. >> did it fall below -- >> it certainly did that day at the white house. >> let's see what happens in the next days, weeks, et cetera. likely you'll be back with us. andrew o'connell, thanks for joining us. ahead, 100 people, 100. that is how many may have been exposed to the ebola patient in dallas. they might not even have known about it. we'll tell you what you need to know about ebola. dr. sanjay gupta will answer your questions. you can tweet it at #ebolaqanda. yeah, i get that a lot. alka seltzer heartburn reliefchews. enjoy the relief.
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at this hour health officials casting a wide net in an effort to track down everyone who might have been exposed to ebola in the united states now that it's been diagnosed for the first time ever here. we're learning authorities are reach outh to as many as 100 people, 100 in the dallas area who may have been in contact with the ebola-stricken patient. video just in to cnn shows janitors wearing the hazmat suits cleaning lowe elementary school in dallas last night, one of the four schools attended by five students, kids who may have had contact with the ebola patient, thomas eric duncan. duncan remains in serious but
stable condition in isolation at texas health presbyterian hospital right now in dallas. >> that's the same hospital that turned him away last week saying his symptoms, quote, did not warrant admission. we now know that duncan was indeed contagious at that time. family members with whom he was staying, they have now been ordered to stay home and not to let any visitors in the home. certainly a lot of questions lingering about ebola. we've asked you to share your questions with us on social media. you've been using #ebolaqanda. joining us from atlanta, chief medical correspondent dr. sanjay gupta. let me ask you the first question here. is it possible that ebola can live on seats, interior door handles, compactionities? can ebola be on stuff that comes in contact with people who have it? >> reporter: this seems like one of the most common questions. i think the best way to sort of
answer this is it can live outside the body, first of all, and it can live on surfaces, talking about the ebola virus. i've heard even up to a few days. sun lied, obviously cleaning the surface, that will help devakt vaet the virus. i think people are trying figure out can i subsequently get it, if i go touch that same surface, can i get it? the answer is theoretically yes. we've talked to several experts in this area, scientists who study this virus and they say the virus does change it a little bit being out of the body, on a surface, so it's less likely to infect. theoretically you could get an infection that way, but very, very low likelihood. the way it most typically is transmitted is direct bodily fluid contact. >> all right. let's pull up another question from twitter. there's one here, somebody concerned about the ability for our pets to get ebola and then pass it on. is that even a concern, sanjay? >> reporter: not in the case of
dogs, for example. i have dogs. a lot of people ask this question. dogs we know can actually have the virus in their bodies but they don't get sick from it, first of all, unlike humans get sick from it. they also don't seem to be able to infect it, pass the virus along and cause an infection. so while the -- if the ebola virus is in an area like we know in certain areas of west africa, he was found in dogs in those areas as well, but they weren't passing the infection along. >> let's stay in the animal kingdom. can you get ebola from a mosquito. we know they transmit so many contagious diseases? >> reporter: thankfully, not this one. it's a very important question. as you might imagine, some of these places in west africa, if this were a mosquito born illness, the numbers of people who would have ebola would be exponentially higher, talking malaria, those types of numbers. obviously mosquitos do take
blood. you think why not then, if a mosquito takes blood, why wouldn't they transmit it? it's as if their bodies, they're not keeping the virus in the same form, the virus may change, become completely inactivated. we can see mosquitos don't carry ebola. >> a question about the disposal of waste. we know hospitals have companies that take their medical waste. this person, angela is wondering specifically about a company that would agree to do this. i'm assuming the risk of coming into contact with that medical waste. >> reporter: you know, it's interesting. we were talking about this a little bit when the patients were at emory university, the first two patients, dr. brantly and dr. writebo lfrnlts. they have standards and procedures when it comes to medical waste in hospitals, and for isolation units. typically what happens is much of the waste is put into these bio containment bags and
subsequently incinerated, set on fire. that's the most common way they handle a lot of this waste. certain parts of the hospital will be handled differently than others. isolation is considered with a much stronger level of consideration. they burn that stuff. >> important questions, san jachlt more important to get the answers from you. we appreciate you being with us, standing outside the cdc where you've been so much the last few days. thanks for that. ahead, our colleague anderson cooper had the opportunity to speak to someone who has been very close to this ebola patient in dallas. he's going to join us, let us know what he has heard, what he knows. that will happen after a short break. you're driving along, having a perfectly nice day, when out of nowhere a pick-up truck slams into your brand new car. one second it wasn't there and the next second...
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we know thomas duncan is a patient light now with ebola in serious conditions. authorities trying to piece together everyone he may have come in contact with. our anderson cooper has had a chance to speak with someone incredibly close to this person. >> anderson is here now and dr. sanjay gupta is listening in. clearly a lot of questions. you had a chance to speak to this woman, girlfriend -- >> she asked us not to use her full name. she is under quarantine. thomas duncan was staying at her apartment, at her place in dallas. she's had a relationship with thomas duncan. i'm not clear of the status of it. one of her kids is from thomas duncan, and she's under quarantine. one of her children is in the hospital with her, as well as two nephews who are in their 20s because those three young people all were in the hospital, in the apartment at the same time that thomas duncan was there and
started showing signs of being sick. she said -- louise brought duncan to the hospital the first time around. >> when he was turned away. >> given antibiotics, given some excedrin, told -- she mentioned twice that he had come from liberia, didn't seem to raise any red flags for anybody there. he was sent back to her place. within two days or so, he started having very -- actually on the bint otics, he started having a lot of diarrhea, making a lot of trips to the bathroom. he was not vomiting according to louise. but he was sweating a lot during the night in her bed. the sheets are still on the bed, she told me. >> in the apartment where she called from. >> in the apartment, the sheets he sweated on are still on the bed, the pillows are still on the bed. the towels he used she put into
plastic bags, they're still in the apartment. she's not clear what to do with them. the cdc has visited her apartment, told her not to go outside, she has to stay inside for 21 days. she's taking her own temperature every hour, taking the temperature of the young people who are in the apartment with her. but she's clearly very concerned, has very strong faith. she's praying a lot. she has talked to thomas duncan on the telephone. she said he is doing the best he can, that he's holding up, but obviously is not feeling well. but she says she has no symptoms at this point. she is just hoping, praying that she's able to get through this. i was surprised to learn that the sheets are still on the bed and that the cdc has not taken or local health officials haven't taken away. >> a lot of brand new information we're getting. i want to bring in dr. sanjay gupta. you just heard anderson describe the situation inside the garn
teen with some details that to me sound a little bit alarming. i wonder if you have any questions about this? >> just the last thing anderson managed there with the sheets still being on the bed, that obviously is a concern. we've talked about the fact that this virus can live outside the body, can live on surfaces. it's unlikely for it to be transmitted to someone else that way. i tell you, the patients over here at emery just down the street, they would take the waste out of a patient's room, put them in bio containment bags and would subsequently be incinerated. you get the idea of the sort of effectiveness they wanted in terms of the virus. it sound like nothing, anderson, in terms of getting rid of things in the apartment were being done here? >> she's not clear what she's supposed to do with this. she seems to think she should wait for the cdc to tell her what to do.
she said she put the towels he used into a plastic bag, they're still in the apartment, but that the sheets and the pillows are still on the bed. she said she did get some bleach that her daughter brought some bleach, so they have had some clorox, that they have tried to clean up in the apartment. but she -- very basic things like she doesn't know how she's going to get food into the apartment. she was told she said maybe the red cross would come by. she's still waiting for that. some health officials brought sandwiches last night but she hasn't had anything today. she's certainly kind of at loose ends and is obviously extremely worried. again, she does not feel that she came into any contact with any fluids to her knowledge she says he didn't vomit on her. she wasn't cleaning up after him. she said he was very much sort of prideful, would take care of himself, go into the bathroom when he had diarrhea.
and also there have been reports of him throwing up outside the apartment shechlt said she never saw him outside the apartment. she wants to make sure people in the apartment complex are informed about how you get ebola. she said there's a lot of misinformation out there. she's concerned about her own kids who aren't even at the house, at the apartment. she has a son who is in college, and she's concerned that people are pointing fingers at him saying, oh, that's somebody who may have ebola. none of those kids came into any contact with thomas duncan. they didn't see him when he was there. she's very concerned about getting the right information to people about how the disease -- how the virus is spread. >> there's so little, so many questions that still linger. we're trying to piece together all of it. sanjay has been a real help doing that. it sound as though she's rhee re lying on the cdc to give her information, the red cross has somewhat reached out. they're sitting there alone in this apartment with only the television, a phone. she reached out to you or we
were you able to get in touch? >> we called her, we were able to reach her. she's very concerned about the media coverage. >> understandably. >> people putting up pictures of some of her children. she said the local news had done that. again, she just wants to get across she is staying in the apartment. she's been informed she's not allowed to leave the apartment. >> and nobody is allowed in as well. >> people aren't allowed in. obviously some health officials have visited. they're being very cause somehow about how they interact with her. she claims he never left the apartment. although she says she never saw it. she was away at work. >> you heard anderson say she doesn't think she came into any bodily fluids. if she was the primary caregiver over these four days where we know he was symptomatic, how hard would it be to stay completely separate from things that could be infectious? >> it's challenging, john.
it's a very good point. oftentimes it's family members that become the first people to also get an infection. you hear about this so many times in west africa, a person gets sick, they stay at home and subsequently the entire family becomes infected. tragic stories where the entire family gets infected. it's tough. even a small amount of infected bodily fluid could cause an infection. if shees watching, i don't want to alarm her. that's exactly why they're doing what they seer doing, to monitor her temperature for 21 days. hopefully she doesn't develop a temperature in 21 days. if she doesn't, she gets the all clear sign at that point. the odds are on her side still. most people are not going to get an infection. if they do, this is exactly the way that it happens. if i could ask one more thing as well, anderson. you said something else, sound like several family members but only four are now being asked to be quarantined.
that is because they are most lickly to have had contact with him or they were there in the apartment when he got sick? >> she said when thomas duncan was staying with her, one of her kids was there, a 13-year-old and two nephews who are in their 20s. those are the three still currently in the apartment, still under quarantine. she has a daughter who lives separately from her. her daughter is the one who actually called the ambulance the second time which brought thomas duncan to the hospital, called for the second hospital visit, the first time he went in an ambulance. it was the daughter who called because when she went to the apartments, she found thomas duncan, shivering, very sick. she had gone there to bring him some tea because louise was at work. so it's not clear to me how much interaction the daughter had with thomas duncan. i asked louise if her daughter is under quarantine as well. she wasn't 100% sure. she said she thought so but didn't know for sure because her daughter is not living with her
in the same apartment. >> one of the concerns, too, of course, they're mapping -- when we talk about this contact mapping, if you will, all the people that those contacts came in touch with. initially she may have been in and out of the apartment, too. we don't know if sanjay, i mean louise said she's a caregiver. i'm not sure? what capacity, but to michaela's point she would not have been a risk to anybody because she, even if she had become infected with the virus, until you actually show symptoms, which often takes up to 21 days, you actually cannot spread the virus to anybody else, so it's important that people not, you know, kind of make this worse than it really is if somebody is infected, a, a blood test won't show it until they show symptoms and the person cannot spread it until they show symptoms, that is correct. >> that's absolutely correct. this idea, i heard the same
thing earlier, michaela, the contacts of kangtss are now being sort of -- they're being sought after as well, i think that may have been misrepresented. when we talk about the dozens or up to 100 people, they're still casting a wide net but the idea is, are these 100 people people who may have come in contact with mr. duncan himself as as opposed to a secondary contact. it's an important point. where does that end? what about the contacts of the contacts of the contacts? >> louise is very -- wants to really point out about her son who's in college, that he had no contact with thomas duncan and, therefore, ooub, you know, nobody should be pointing fingers at him. she's concerned about the hysteria that can develop in a case like this. >> before we are talking about this quarantine, the fact that these four people were or are being quarantined. you've spoken to one of them, but sanjay, this does seem to shed light on whys this group is being kept like this at this point, because of the level of
contact that we now know they did have? >> yepp. this is a little bit of a nuance point but i think a really important one. it just -- it follows up on what anderson was just saying. you're not going to spread the disease until you are sick, but you don't want to create a scenario where someone is monitored in the morning, temperature taken in the morning and gone all day but at 9:00 or 10:00 in the morning starts to get sick. starts to get really sick. doesn't come home until later that evening but now you have several hours where the person may have been sick and out and about. that's the situation you don't want to have happen because at that point they could potentially start transmitting the virus. if you're concerned about somebody in this regard, the quarantine is done really to try to keep the general public safe. it's not an exact science. remember at the beginning, i don't think they quarantined members of the family initially but decided to do so. >> it's interesting we were talking a lot, sanjay, with you about the preparedness of hospitals and medical personnel
across the country and you had a chance to speak to lieus weise about that initial visit to the hospital. did she talk at all about her frustration or about her concern about going to the hospital and not getting kind of the care and attention they were hoping for? >> you know, the issue -- she didn't think about boebola at t time, it didn't cross her mind, didn't raise it, she thought it might be malaria, some of the symptoms. she's been in the united states for a very long time. but he had a fever of about 101 and so that's why she brought him to the hospital. she -- i don't think -- she didn't express concern about the level of care that he was initially given. i mean they gave him antibiotics and they were there for about three and a half hours, four hours. it wasn't until her daughter found him in the apartment several days later, shivering, that he was brought in and then she went to the hospital and she says, then she was actually put
off by some of the things that a nurse said to her about we're testing him for ebola, your country has a lot of viruss. >> had the travel history come up in the first visit? >> louise says she mentioned twice he had come from liberia, just come from liberia, where he didn't have a social security number and in that context both -- she said both to the person checking them in when you first go to the emergency room and someone checks you in. she raised that to the person. also to a nurse she says as well. >> the only person right now that we believes has spoken to her and she's the only direct contact we know to thomas duncan. give us a sense of how she's doing and had he's doing right now? >> this is a woman of strong faith and she talks about that faith, a preacher who -- from the church she attends has called her and you know she hopes that she's -- all she's doing is just praying and taking her temperature and the temperature of everybody in that apartment and she says she it
continues to talk to tombs maho every day. >> we heard reports thomas had been -- he got sickened from assisting a pregnant woman with ebola in liberia. >> i asked louise about that. she said she didn't know anything about that at all, that he had not mentioned anything to her. i mean i found it odd, you know, if you have someone visiting from liberia and this is a country where ebola is, you know, has been killing people. >> top of mind mostly. >> you would think you would start to talk about it. louise says it didn't come up in the discussion. she didn't ask about ebola and thomas duncan mentioned nothing about assisting somebody. again, exactly what their conversations were, i'm not sure. that's what she told me. but we'll see. >> it is interesting. no sense did he talk about what he had been through at all, forgetting how he felt, the fact that he assisted a woman who died from ebola days before he came to the united states. >> yeah. again, you know, she says she doesn't know anything about
that. she didn't hear anything about that. whether or not that's the case, doesn't want to talk about it, i'm not clear. you know, they -- she refers to thomas duncan sometimes as her husband, sometimes as the father of at least one of her children. they're not legally married but they clearly have some sort of relationship. >> so 2 to 21 days is the incubation period we understand. we're a day or a few days into this. how is she feeling? you mentioned they've had some food, haven't had any today. is she feeling like there's going to be a plan for them? >> she said the cdc told her they would be stopping by every day. they haven't come today. she -- you know, she -- she said she's a caretaker so she certainly, you know, seems adept to taking temperatures. she seems aware of what one is supposed to do. for me, the most surprising thing i guess the sheets on the bed, she's not sleeping on that bed anymore, she's been sleeping in the living room. again, how they're going to dispose of that is clearly something the cdc or local
health officials need to do. >> sanjay, is there anything at this point medical officials can do for this woman, for these four people in quarantine right now, other than visit and monitor? i know zmapp not much of it around, been given to a few people, something like that, if it existed be of assistance pro fa lackically? >> no. there's no real evidence on the zmapp being beneficial here. it's given to people who have already been exposed and sick and we don't know evidence that she's been -- she has ebola virus or she is -- doesn't sound like she's sick from what anderson is saying as well. there would be no role here. i think one of the most important things and the department health folks in texas are listening, getting the apartment cleaned up like they would any other patient care area because sounds like that apartment was a patient care area for this man for mr. duncan for about four days. so you would want to treat, you know, the waste in there like you treat hospital waste which
again they would bring biocontainment bags in. these are double layered bags. put them in there and then they're taken out and this is done in a coordinated way and then it's insince rated and that's -- every state has their own policy on this but those are general guidelines. i would imagine that would be one thing they could do for her if for no other reason to give her peace of mind on this. >> it's interesting. you talked about the protocol for dealing with waste in a hospital environment. thankfully she's a health care worker of some sort and sounds like she has a reasonable amount of sense about what to do, but even still, she's likely not equipped to handle all this. was she sounding panicked that way, i'm at a loss of where to go from here. >> she feels under siege. >> i bet. >> she's locked in -- not locked but she is told she can't go outside her apartment. she would face legal consequences if she did. she's been told, you know,s there's a lot of unknowns and uncertainty and i think she has a lot of concern about i think
she's watching a lot of television, there's not much else she can do. i think she's concerned about people pointing fing ears the her other children who have had no contact. >> are they cared for? do we know if they're okay? the other children are -- >> they've had no contact with -- she says they've had no contact with thomas duncan, no reason anybody should be pointing fingers at them and wants other people in her complex to be given real information about ebola. >> not just panicked. >> just kind of tell people how they actually, you know, the difficulty of actually getting it. it's not airborne. she doesn't want people in her apartment complex completely getting concerned freaking out. she's very concerned about, you know, the -- this kind of -- the rippling effects of all this. her works has been contacted by the cdc. >> they're aware. >> she will continue to be paid she's told during this time she's not able to go to work. >> the woman is at home right now. re-set for a second and remind people going on.
the first person in the united states to be diagnosed with ebola right now is inside a hospital in dallas right now. he's in isolation being watched very closely to medical officials. we learned today that four people have been quarantined in that dallas area. four people who had been close to this man right here, thomas duncan, are in quarantine right now. anderson cooper has spoken to one of those people in quarantine, a woman, who is the partner of this ebola patient, tom thomas duncan anderson has exclusive details not just about the ebola patient but the woman and the people in quarantine right now who were very close to him during the period he was symptomatic. >> i spoke to louise who is not legally married to thomas duncan but has had a relationship with him. thomas duncan was visiting her apartment in dallas when he became sick. louise is the person who took thomas duncan to the hospital the first time. says twice that she